Fibaro Universal Binary sensor wrong temperature, no outputs

[Elektrotek]

Hello,
I set up a project which includes a Fibaro Universal Binary Sensor, input from PIR and output to a 12v relay.
I also attached temperature readings form DS18B20.
- The devices show crazy temperatures (169c). I tried with many DS18B20 sensors of different providers. Binary outputs are shown at 255% level always. I have measured the fibaro sensor inputs and DS18B20 pins, and they have always voltage (2,6-3V). Is it normal?
- The output relays are irresponsive.
I am getting desperate about the crazy temperature readings and the inactivity of the output relays. Can anyone tell what is wrong?
Note: dates are wrong, I know.

Circuit schematics. All fibaro sensor inputs have always voltage. Is it normal? Anything wrong?

Schematics.png (46.03 KiB) Viewed 8904 times

I installed Domoticz image from sourceforge.net/projects/domoticz/files ... z/download.

Hardware. Everything seems in place.

Hardware.png (23.59 KiB) Viewed 8904 times

List of devices. These are included without any problem. But readings are confusing.

devices.PNG (48.79 KiB) Viewed 8904 times

[[email protected]]

I have two of these devices working with Aeon Zstick interface (USB).

It IS normal to see voltage on the sensor lines: these are digital ICs containing a sensor element but also analogue-to-digital converter, and bus interface logic. If you probe the sensor lines using an oscilloscope you will see the data transfers in the forrn of pulses. Using a volt-meter will simply give you averaged voltage levels. Full information is available in the device data sheets. It is vital that all sensors be wired correctly as shown in the diagram you provided, and that the cables should be of high quality. The best cable is screened twisted pair. Poor quality cables will not support the high-speed digital communications over a long distance.

One important point: The Fibaro multi-sensor will determine how many sensors are attached (and at what addresses) when it is first associated with your network. If you subsequently change the number of sensors, new sensors will not be recognised unless you exclude the device and re-include it. I think this also applies for a reduction in the number of sensors.

The Fibaro multi-sensor does not have conventional relays - it has opto-coupled transistor-switched outputs. These will follow the state of the corresponding input signals by changing their resistance regardless of the Z-wave operations. It is NOT possible to control these output switches via the Z-Wave network - all the sensor does is to read their state. Some bias supply is required to ensure that a current flows in these switch outputs (and that current should not be too large).

If your system is not functioning as expected, I suggest a check of the sensor wiring, excluding the sensor from the network and then re-including it.

Good luck!

[Elektrotek]

I have two of these devices working with Aeon Zstick interface (USB).
The Fibaro multi-sensor does not have conventional relays - it has opto-coupled transistor-switched outputs. These will follow the state of the corresponding input signals by changing their resistance regardless of the Z-wave operations. It is NOT possible to control these output switches via the Z-Wave network - all the sensor does is to read their state. Some bias supply is required to ensure that a current flows in these switch outputs (and that current should not be too large).

Thank you so much for your advice Tony.
- Does the optocouple "generate" its own current between its terminals, or has to be connected like a normal relay-like shown in the schematics-?

If your system is not functioning as expected, I suggest a check of the sensor wiring, excluding the sensor from the network and then re-including it.
Good luck!

- Cabling is not likely to be the problem, since the circuit is set on a high-quality test-board.
- I have tried connecting, reseting, formatting, including, excluding... all combinations possible over many days, and nothing seems to work. Temperatures are always 150-170c.
- I have also tried many sensors and two fibaro universals, and it is the same. No matter if I test them with a temperature sensor only, directly out of the package...

I am getting hopeless. I think that fibaro universal sensor cannot run on domoticz.

Test board installation

IMG_20150726_174829 (00000002).jpg (225.75 KiB) Viewed 8862 times

[Domosapiens]

I think that fibaro universal sensor cannot run on domoticz

I have 4 of them working with Domoticz like a charm, for almost 1 year (?) now.

Wrong connection to the DS18B20?

Domosapiens

[Edit]

What type of power supply are you using ?
Take care for an under-dimensioning
Take a look here:
http://www.domoticz.com/forum/viewtopic ... 811#p21269

[ThinkPad]

+1 for powersupply here, make sure you have a powersupply with enough power. Have seen weird things when a powersupply was faulty/not powerful enough (ipcam that kept restarting for example).

[[email protected]]

A couple of clarifications:

The opto-couplers DO NOT generate any voltage of their own; when activated, the resistance across the output terminals will drop to a low-ish value. If the opto-coupler output is connected in series with a load (like a relay,or a LED plus current-limit resistor), and there is an external power source, then the load can be energised by the opto-coupler. Observe the proper current limits!

Second point has been raised already: the universal sensor needs 12V nominal to operate. It can run down to about 9V, but it is "rated" at 12 V (from memory). It will not run from a lower supply voltage like 5V or 3.3V. Can you confirm the power supply voltage applied to the Universal Sensor?

It may be that the communications to the sensor are marginal. I would still advise using a screened twisted pair cable, or perhaps making up a short length of three wires twisted into a triple. I concede that this is unlikely to be the issue.

You appear to have some temperature readings: are these responsive to the sensor? (i.e. if the sensor is warmed, do the readings rise?) Could you report on this point? Is your Domoticz system set to display in Celcius or in Fahrenheit?

Have you set the correct configuration for the Universal Sensor in Domoticz? For the Setup / hardware / Z-Wave interface page, select teh line containing your sensor. At the bottom of the display are the configuration parameters 9scroll down). Have you set the input types to match the signals that you are applying to the Universal Sensor? In my case, I have "Normally Open" to match a "push button".

Also in the configuration is the rate at which the temperature sensors are read by the Universal sensor, the (potentially different) rate at which temperatures are reported, and a sensitivity parameter that can suppress reporting if the temperature changes are too small. Are all these configuration parameters set up appropriately?

I can confirm that I have two of these units, and they both run perfectly with Domoticz and the Aeon Z-Stick USB adapter.

[Elektrotek]

Thank you again Tomy, Domosapiens and ThinkPad for your sensible advice. This is very kind of you.

The sensors seem to be just always activated to the maximum level (including temperatures). No matter if they are set to Normally Open (NO).

I have two of these devices working with Aeon Zstick interface (USB).

- Nevermind. Therefore, mine is a strange case indeed.

+1 for powersupply here, make sure you have a powersupply with enough power. Have seen weird things when a powersupply was faulty/not powerful enough (ipcam that kept restarting for example).

- That can be a problem, ThinkPad. I have no oscilloscope, just a multimeter, so I cannot assess the harmonic distortion created by the source. I have just ordered a similar power source, with greater power. The present source can be seen in the picture below: a 12V regulable supply (1000-SNG-0W max 12V 1A). I have tried 9 and 12V, with same results.

- The wiring is direct on a high-quality test board. No distance among them and contacts are proven by multimeter.
- The pin positions of the DS18B20 are correct and strongly attached. The sensor is completely cold. Reports in Celsius. Report parameters are default.

See the pictures of the test circuit with only one probe attached, with the corresponding Domoticz interface.

Power source and test circuit with only one sensor

IMG_20150727_215549 (00000002).jpg (281.75 KiB) Viewed 8825 times

Devices menu. See overexcited, inert sensors. The one at 0 is unplugged. Is it due to harmonic distortion? No idea what causes this.

Captura1.PNG (102.63 KiB) Viewed 8825 times

[Domosapiens]

12VA or 12V / 1A must be enough.
I have 2 running on a 12 / 1A power supply.
But .... I see another 2 units on the same power supply, what do they need ?

Don't see an Elco, take one of 470uF / 25V.
If the A/D conversion for temperature is executed it needs some peak current.
Same for Z-Wave transmission, the Elco takes care of that.

It could be that the multimeter gives an average indication of around 12V, but if one of the 4 rectifiers (brugcel) in your power supply is broken,
there is a huge ripple on your DC.

I see Brown on pin 3 of the DS18B20, Blue on pin 1, White on 2 ... that is correct.

Hope this helps
Domosapiens

[Elektrotek]

12VA or 12V / 1A must be enough.
I have 2 running on a 12 / 1A power supply.
But .... I see another 2 units on the same power supply, what do they need ?

Don't see an Elco, take one of 470uF / 25V.
If the A/D conversion for temperature is executed it needs some peak current.
Same for Z-Wave transmission, the Elco takes care of that.

It could be that the multimeter gives an average indication of around 12V, but if one of the 4 rectifiers (brugcel) in your power supply is broken,
there is a huge ripple on your DC.

I see Brown on pin 3 of the DS18B20, Blue on pin 1, White on 2 ... that is correct.

Hope this helps
Domosapiens

Thank you very much Domosapiens.Your suggestion to put a LP filter at the source makes so much sense!
I also purchased a large sortiment of capacitors. Can the LP filter be done by just adding any shunt capacitor C>470uF U>25on the +- terminals of the busbar?

The universal sensor is only connected to the DS18B20 for testing purposes. The binary inputs are floating -no inputs-.
The diode is just to show light whenever the board is energized by closing the small switch on the right. The cable with the + label is the anode of the source, which is shown uplugged right on the picture.
I guess that, without a proper oscilloscope, there is no way to visualize the ripple. But if I measure the 12V DC terminals, it is 12,1. Maybe the added RMS is result of the harmonic content. I am just guessing, since I am a newbie do not have practical knowledge of electronics.

BR,
Elektrotek

[Domosapiens]

Elektrotek
Yes, an electrolytic capacitor over + and - (take care of polarity!)
I would not call that a Low Pass filter, it's only for smoothing the ripple.

Is the LED working without a series resistor ???
Are you sure that is correct ?
I would expect a 560 Ohm resistor to limit the current through the LED.

Any other 12V power supply available in the house ?
Would try it without the LED.

Good luck
Domosapiens

[Elektrotek]

Dear Domosapiens,

Thank you so much for your help, but I have been trying very hard and now I am hopeless about this.
I have connected high quality 12V sources -even medical grade-, with and without condenser, in the simplest arrangement possible. Several times each. No leds.
No changes. All binary entries (which are disconnected) and sensors are displayed at maximum level.

I am sure that this is an obscure software issue. Does anybody recommend an alternative to Domoticz which I can use for testing purposes?

Here is the log.

Spoiler: show

2015-07-30 21:59:52.583 OpenZWave: Node Include command initiated...
2015-07-30 21:59:52.586 OpenZWave: Command is starting
2015-07-30 21:59:52.592 OpenZWave: Waiting for User action...
2015-07-30 21:59:56.639 Hardware Monitor: Fetching data (System sensors)
2015-07-30 21:59:57.076 OpenZWave: Controller is communicating with Other devices to carry out the command
2015-07-30 21:59:57.265 OpenZWave: Controller is communicating with Other devices to carry out the command
2015-07-30 21:59:57.655 OpenZWave: Controller is communicating with Other devices to carry out the command
2015-07-30 21:59:57.715 OpenZWave: Value_Added: Node: 16 (0x10), CommandClass: SENSOR BINARY, Label: Sensor, Instance: 0
2015-07-30 21:59:57.716 (Controlador) Lighting 2 (Unknown)
2015-07-30 21:59:58.110 OpenZWave: Value_Added: Node: 16 (0x10), CommandClass: SENSOR BINARY, Label: Sensor, Instance: 2
2015-07-30 21:59:58.111 (Controlador) Lighting 2 (Unknown)
2015-07-30 22:00:08.293 (Controlador) Lighting 2 (Sensor)
2015-07-30 22:00:08.332 (Controlador) Lighting 2 (Sensor)
2015-07-30 22:00:08.393 OpenZWave: Received timeout notification from HomeID: 4232497053, NodeID: 16 (0x10)
2015-07-30 22:00:18.396 (Controlador) Lighting 2 (Sensor)
2015-07-30 22:00:18.417 (Controlador) Lighting 2 (Sensor)
2015-07-30 22:00:18.438 OpenZWave: Received timeout notification from HomeID: 4232497053, NodeID: 16 (0x10)
2015-07-30 22:00:19.208 (Controlador) Lighting 2 (Sensor)
2015-07-30 22:00:19.269 (Controlador) Lighting 2 (Sensor)
2015-07-30 22:00:19.331 OpenZWave: Value_Added: Node: 16 (0x10), CommandClass: SENSOR MULTILEVEL, Label: Temperature, Instance: 1
2015-07-30 22:00:19.331 (Controlador) Temp (Unknown)
2015-07-30 22:00:19.403 OpenZWave: Value_Added: Node: 16 (0x10), CommandClass: SENSOR MULTILEVEL, Label: Temperature, Instance: 2
2015-07-30 22:00:19.403 (Controlador) Temp (Unknown)
2015-07-30 22:00:27.036 Hardware Monitor: Fetching data (System sensors)
2015-07-30 22:00:40.592 (Controlador) Temp (Unknown)
2015-07-30 22:00:40.612 (Controlador) Temp (Unknown)
2015-07-30 22:00:57.185 Hardware Monitor: Fetching data (System sensors)
2015-07-30 22:01:27.383 Hardware Monitor: Fetching data (System sensors)
2015-07-30 22:01:57.532 Hardware Monitor: Fetching data (System sensors)
2015-07-30 22:02:27.681 Hardware Monitor: Fetching data (System sensors)

© 2012-201

[Domosapiens]

Elektrotek
I can understand your desperation.

Your log looks good
2 binary sensors
2 multilevel sensors
.......
But at that time: did you have two DS18B20 sensors connected? On your photo it was only one !
If you change the configuration (or a DS18B20 sensor) you need to Exclude the device and Include it to Z-Wave again. (with the small button on the FGBS001, read the manual)

Are all the wrong temperature values consistent: in your Temperature Tab, in the Devices list and in the OpenZwave Node Management - Control Panel?
If so, the incoming value is wrong.
Then it could be that your FGBS001 is not functioning correct.

Never used OpenHab (or so) but you could give it a try.
Hope the moderators don't kill me for this.

keep on trying!
Domosapiens

[Elektrotek]

Elektrotek
I can understand your desperation.

Your log looks good
2 binary sensors
2 multilevel sensors
.......
But at that time: did you have two DS18B20 sensors connected? On your photo it was only one !
If you change the configuration (or a DS18B20 sensor) you need to Exclude the device and Include it to Z-Wave again. (with the small button on the FGBS001, read the manual)

Are all the wrong temperature values consistent: in your Temperature Tab, in the Devices list and in the OpenZwave Node Management - Control Panel?
If so, the incoming value is wrong.
Then it could be that your FGBS001 is not functioning correct.

Never used OpenHab (or so) but you could give it a try.
Hope the moderators don't kill me for this.

keep on trying!
Domosapiens

Thanks Domosapiens.
- I follow all steps described in the manual. Inclusion and exclusion are always successful and all devices are well detected.
- Yes 2x DS18B20 were connected. I tried five different temperatur DS18B20 sensors and they are always successfully detected, but with the same crazy output frozen on the top of the scale. All temperatures are the same.
- Yes, all values are crazy but consistent among menus.

Let´s see that openHab, but I am not very optimistic ...

[xs4me]

Hi Elektrotek,

as many others I also have a FGBS001 with 4 DS18B20 sensors and a Aeon Z-Stick USB adapter. As power supply for the FGBS001 I use an old phone charger; 9V If i remember correctly.

Others have stressed this already and I will repeat, if you add/remove sensors you must exclude and re-include the device. (Did you device get a new Node ID after re-including? Was your device really gone after excluding it, check this in the OZW control panel?)

Can you show the OZW logs? starting from where you include the device up to a few temp readings?
Maybe that holds some clue what is going on here.

What versions for OZW and Domoticz are you using? Can you also tell something about the hardware you use to run Domoticz? (windows/linux/nas/RPy/...)

xs4me

[Elektrotek]

Dear all,

Thank you for your kind and valuable advice. I have followed all your hints but, unluckily, none has worked out.
I have other devices, which work well, but the fibaro universal sensor seems to be a remarkable exception.
I followed the instructions by the detail. I installed the deficient "ready-to-go" domoticz image. I even tried with two different units, razberry instead of uzb, different sensors, updating all modules, etc.
Reports exaclty the same temperatures.

Fibaro offers no support at all.

Given the compatibility issues that still exist in z-wave, I have assumed that there is no solution to this problem.
Best regards,
Elektrotek

[franzelare]

I purchased 3 of these boards but keep having trouble with the digital inputs
- one for general testing in my study
- one to read the status my rain sensor that is located outside, but the board is just inside with the power supply of the rain sensor (where the temperature is of no use but more data is always better)
- one in the spare freezer to see if the door is closed on monitor the temperature
The temperature sensors work fine (I only have 1 on each board) but the inputs don’t

The inputs work for a while after including the device in the Z-wave network, but get stuck at random moments.
While the temperature sensor keeps reporting so the communication is still up.
Not every board seem to freeze as often as the other… the one in my study can read a few status changes while the one for my rain sensor works fine for a while...

When I try to exclude the device (through the control panel or separate with the button on the Z-wave stick) it doesn't always allow me, sometimes I need to leave the device powered off for a while, exclude it and later include it again to work for a while....

All in all the sensor board is a disappointment to me, I was planning to use a couple of these boards so I don’t have to wire all sensor to the piface on one of my raspberry’s.
But since it is not reliable enough I will just old fasion wire all sensors…

I also have the fibaro flood sensor, that seems to work reliable for about half a year now, so I’m thinking about modifying that and use the tilt and flood status as digital inputs… but an additional doorsensor might be cheaper to modify for places hard to hardwire.

[Elektrotek]

I have tried a similar setup, with a brand new raspberry and other components. Still the same problem though.
Does anybody have a clue to know what is happening inside this system with more detail, or is anybody working on that?
Is the fibaro universal sensor really working reliably with Domoticz, honestly?
BR,
Elektrotek

[Jantje1972]

i can confirm honestly the universal binary sensor is working perfect, im using it wit 2 switches and 2 18b20 sensors and it is rock solid. temperature readings are in the expected range an switches are always being send to domoticz.

[Domosapiens]

Is the fibaro universal sensor really working with Domoticz, honestly?

Not so nice question.
A few people work extreme hard to extend Domoticz all the time (Gizmocuz and his team),
and a few happy users try to help you ....... and you question their integrity.

I have 4 of them working for a long time.
Two are under installation (DIN rail housing), so no result yet.

Please check your OpenZwave Control Panel to see if we are talking about the same:
FIBARO System FGBS001 Universal Binary Sensor
Library version: 3
Protocol Version: 3.52
Application Version: 2.01

Hope this helps
Domosapiens

[Elektrotek]

Is the fibaro universal sensor really working with Domoticz, honestly?

Not so nice question.
A few people work extreme hard to extend Domoticz all the time (Gizmocuz and his team),
and a few happy users try to help you ....... and you question their integrity.

I have 4 of them working for a long time.
Two are under installation (DIN rail housing), so no result yet.

Please check your OpenZwave Control Panel to see if we are talking about the same:
FIBARO System FGBS001 Universal Binary Sensor
Library version: 3
Protocol Version: 3.52
Application Version: 2.01

Hope this helps
Domosapiens

Please, do not misunderstand me. There are several similar reported problems with the device measurements. I shall add "reliably" at the end of the phrase.
Probably my case is extreme, but nevertheless this problem still exist. For me Domoticz is THE BEST open source platform and I want to work to kill this problem.
This does not contradict the fact that there are devoted people working for making Domoticz better every day and I would like to collaborate, but it is necessary to clarify and compile all information possible about the related issues.

Regarding my fibaro software, it shows exactly the same library, protocol and application version as yours.
Thank you very much for the advice.

Best regards,
Elektrotek