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PI or NAS
Posted: Tuesday 14 November 2017 9:31
by har0543
Hi,
I have Domoticz running on a Raspberry pi. This works ok although I have some "database disk image is malformed" errors sometimes.
I also have an Synology NAS. I installed Domoticz on it and changed one sensor to it.
This works.
Question is now: What is the best system to run Domoticz on a Pi or a NAS, in therms of energy consumption and reliability?
Harry
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Tuesday 14 November 2017 9:37
by EdwinK
Energy-wise I would say the PI is using less power then the Synology. Realibily wise I think they both are the same.
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Tuesday 14 November 2017 16:40
by Siewert308SW
For 1.5 years i run my root from a Seagate 1TB Expansion HDD on my Pi3.
No need for extra powered HUB and never saw any corrupt database or anything else.
Made this choice after 2 corrupt sd-cards in 6 months and happy a turned over.
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Tuesday 14 November 2017 16:56
by EdwinK
Siewert308SW wrote: ↑Tuesday 14 November 2017 16:40
For 1.5 years i run my root from a Seagate 1TB Expansion HDD on my Pi3.
That will be the next step. Still got a 2TB Seagate drive somewhere. Can be used for this. First figure out how-to do this
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Tuesday 14 November 2017 17:02
by Siewert308SW
EdwinK wrote: ↑Tuesday 14 November 2017 16:56
Siewert308SW wrote: ↑Tuesday 14 November 2017 16:40
For 1.5 years i run my root from a Seagate 1TB Expansion HDD on my Pi3.
That will be the next step. Still got a 2TB Seagate drive somewhere. Can be used for this. First figure out how-to do this
Depends on how many amps the HDD is asking.
My Seagate drive ask for .48 amps so it is usable without a extra powered USB hub.
Some drive do ask more then you have to use a USB powered hub.
As for a how to:
viewtopic.php?t=14525
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Tuesday 14 November 2017 19:16
by Siewert308SW
gordonb3 wrote: ↑Tuesday 14 November 2017 18:49
Siewert308SW wrote: ↑Tuesday 14 November 2017 16:40
For 1.5 years i run my root from a Seagate 1TB Expansion HDD on my Pi3.
No need for extra powered HUB and never saw any corrupt database or anything else.
Made this choice after 2 corrupt sd-cards in 6 months and happy a turned over.
Beware! If you hear a `ping` or clicking noise at regular intervals (say ~10 seconds) then you're drive is killing itself. You may also be able to feel the associated movement inside the drive by touching the encasing. To verify you can run the following command:
(or whatever device designation the drive received)
Watch for the line that says `Load_Cycle_Count`. You will likely see a ridiculously high number there that may already be far above the manufacturer's life expectancy specifications. What this means is that your drive may die on you any second now. If you want to run your Pi (or a plug computer) like this you shoud use a proper encasing with passive cooling and a NAS specification drive. Which will effectively even use less power than the `green` expansion drive, even though the specifications may state otherwise.
Drive never clicks, runs smoothly for 1,5 years now.
I did a lot of rebooting and APM is disabled each time my Pi reboots since 2 months.
I bought the drive somewhere in 2014 so the stats don't worry me.
Although the Load_cycle_count is 377441 isn't something i worry about as the expected Load_cycle_count is approx at 600000
Code: Select all
=== START OF INFORMATION SECTION ===
Model Family: Seagate Momentus SpinPoint M8 (AF)
Device Model: ST1000LM024 HN-M101MBB
Serial Number: S30CJ9CG347506
LU WWN Device Id: 5 0004cf 20f76a5b3
Firmware Version: 2BA30003
User Capacity: 1,000,204,886,016 bytes [1.00 TB]
Sector Sizes: 512 bytes logical, 4096 bytes physical
Rotation Rate: 5400 rpm
Form Factor: 2.5 inches
Device is: In smartctl database [for details use: -P show]
ATA Version is: ATA8-ACS T13/1699-D revision 6
SATA Version is: SATA 3.0, 6.0 Gb/s (current: 3.0 Gb/s)
Local Time is: Tue Nov 14 19:11:43 2017 CET
SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability.
SMART support is: Enabled
=== START OF READ SMART DATA SECTION ===
SMART overall-health self-assessment test result: PASSED
General SMART Values:
Offline data collection status: (0x00) Offline data collection activity
was never started.
Auto Offline Data Collection: Disabled.
Self-test execution status: ( 0) The previous self-test routine completed
without error or no self-test has ever
been run.
Total time to complete Offline
data collection: (12060) seconds.
Offline data collection
capabilities: (0x5b) SMART execute Offline immediate.
Auto Offline data collection on/off support.
Suspend Offline collection upon new
command.
Offline surface scan supported.
Self-test supported.
No Conveyance Self-test supported.
Selective Self-test supported.
SMART capabilities: (0x0003) Saves SMART data before entering
power-saving mode.
Supports SMART auto save timer.
Error logging capability: (0x01) Error logging supported.
General Purpose Logging supported.
Short self-test routine
recommended polling time: ( 2) minutes.
Extended self-test routine
recommended polling time: ( 201) minutes.
SCT capabilities: (0x003f) SCT Status supported.
SCT Error Recovery Control supported.
SCT Feature Control supported.
SCT Data Table supported.
SMART Attributes Data Structure revision number: 16
Vendor Specific SMART Attributes with Thresholds:
ID# ATTRIBUTE_NAME FLAG VALUE WORST THRESH TYPE UPDATED WHEN_FAILED RAW_VALUE
1 Raw_Read_Error_Rate 0x002f 100 100 051 Pre-fail Always - 0
2 Throughput_Performance 0x0026 055 055 000 Old_age Always - 11003
3 Spin_Up_Time 0x0023 092 090 025 Pre-fail Always - 2672
4 Start_Stop_Count 0x0032 099 099 000 Old_age Always - 1335
5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct 0x0033 252 252 010 Pre-fail Always - 0
7 Seek_Error_Rate 0x002e 252 252 051 Old_age Always - 0
8 Seek_Time_Performance 0x0024 252 252 015 Old_age Offline - 0
9 Power_On_Hours 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 9070
10 Spin_Retry_Count 0x0032 252 252 051 Old_age Always - 0
11 Calibration_Retry_Count 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 356
12 Power_Cycle_Count 0x0032 099 099 000 Old_age Always - 1336
191 G-Sense_Error_Rate 0x0022 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 629
192 Power-Off_Retract_Count 0x0022 099 099 000 Old_age Always - 1215
194 Temperature_Celsius 0x0002 064 057 000 Old_age Always - 31 (Min/Max 21/44)
195 Hardware_ECC_Recovered 0x003a 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0
196 Reallocated_Event_Count 0x0032 252 252 000 Old_age Always - 0
197 Current_Pending_Sector 0x0032 252 252 000 Old_age Always - 0
198 Offline_Uncorrectable 0x0030 252 252 000 Old_age Offline - 0
199 UDMA_CRC_Error_Count 0x0036 200 200 000 Old_age Always - 0
200 Multi_Zone_Error_Rate 0x002a 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 19255
223 Load_Retry_Count 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 356
225 Load_Cycle_Count 0x0032 063 063 000 Old_age Always - 377441
SMART Error Log Version: 1
No Errors Logged
SMART Self-test log structure revision number 1
Num Test_Description Status Remaining LifeTime(hours) LBA_of_first_error
# 1 Short offline Completed without error 00% 9070 -
# 2 Short offline Completed without error 00% 9070 -
# 3 Extended offline Interrupted (host reset) 50% 8365 -
# 4 Extended offline Completed without error 00% 4119 -
# 5 Short offline Completed without error 00% 4116 -
# 6 Extended offline Aborted by host 90% 4116 -
SMART Selective self-test log data structure revision number 0
Note: revision number not 1 implies that no selective self-test has ever been run
SPAN MIN_LBA MAX_LBA CURRENT_TEST_STATUS
1 0 0 Completed [00% left] (0-65535)
2 0 0 Not_testing
3 0 0 Not_testing
4 0 0 Not_testing
5 0 0 Not_testing
Selective self-test flags (0x0):
After scanning selected spans, do NOT read-scan remainder of disk.
If Selective self-test is pending on power-up, resume after 0 minute delay.
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Tuesday 14 November 2017 21:22
by HansieNL
Running Domoticz on a Raspberry Pi with a external SSD. Rasbian is installed via BerryBoot to SSD and then installed Domoticz. Running smoothly for more than a year now.
I had a read-only sd-card twice before, that's why I choose for a SSD solution.
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Tuesday 14 November 2017 21:26
by freakshock
So is there any reason not to run Domoticz on a NAS like a Synology if it runs 24/7 anyway?
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Tuesday 14 November 2017 21:32
by Siewert308SW
freakshock wrote: ↑Tuesday 14 November 2017 21:26
So is there any reason not to run Domoticz on a NAS like a Synology if it runs 24/7 anyway?
If your keen on power consumption, maybe?
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Tuesday 14 November 2017 22:11
by Egregius
If the Syno runs 24/7 anyway and it isn't one of those cheap models run it there.
Otherwise a Pi is a good solution if you keep good backups in case of SD failure.
I used both but switched to a Intel Nuc, running Debian in a container on Proxmox. Hasn't ran faster than this before AND it's very easy to take complete system snapshots.
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Wednesday 15 November 2017 14:54
by koowee
Do you have any experience of these small SSD drives with RPi or is this about same that normal USB memory stick?
https://www.amazon.com/Kingspec-Speed-S ... B00JF0AVJ6
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Wednesday 15 November 2017 17:05
by EdwinK
Those look nice. And cheap. No experence with any ssd. Hope they are good, then i might buy me one.
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Wednesday 15 November 2017 20:27
by har0543
Hi,
Thanks for all the kind responses.
As my NAS is always on I changed to the NAS version.
In the NAS are two WD Red WD40EFRX, 4TB drives.
Is it wise to use an USB drive for the database and/or backups to reduce the use of the drives in the NAS
regards,
Harry
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Wednesday 15 November 2017 22:25
by heggink
Wd have a pi specific drive which I use for 2 pi's. Power much better than 3.5 drive since it's a 2.5". As to green vs red, there is a wd setting to disable the idle timer on greens (wdidle3) . Did that for my freenas system. Whilst the red's are sold for nas, they are internally identical and over priced (for the exact same URE rate). Worked great and has been running for years with no increase in LCC.
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Thursday 16 November 2017 8:42
by BakSeeDaa
Siewert308SW wrote: ↑Tuesday 14 November 2017 16:40
Made this choice after 2 corrupt sd-cards in 6 months and happy a turned over.
Just curious, I never had problems with any SD card ever. What brand/model of SD card did you use? Was it really a class 10 of good quality or was it one of those cheap chinese "no name" SD-cards that gets bundled for free? (No need to say, the latter is useless of course)
Personally I would never use anything else but
Sandisk Extreme PRO micro SD when it comes to SD-cards. (Not, "Ultra", not just "Extreme" but "
Extreme PRO") But that's me. It would typically cost you a few bucks more.
mdmobcmKD2P296GEaNLHJhg.jpg
Cheers!
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Thursday 16 November 2017 10:08
by Siewert308SW
BakSeeDaa wrote: ↑Thursday 16 November 2017 8:42
Siewert308SW wrote: ↑Tuesday 14 November 2017 16:40
Made this choice after 2 corrupt sd-cards in 6 months and happy a turned over.
Just curious, I never had problems with any SD card ever. What brand/model of SD card did you use? Was it really a class 10 of good quality or was it one of those cheap chinese "no name" SD-cards that gets bundled for free? (No need to say, the latter is useless of course)
Personally I would never use anything else but
Sandisk Extreme PRO micro SD when it comes to SD-cards. (Not, "Ultra", not just "Extreme" but "
Extreme PRO") But that's me. It would typically cost you a few bucks more.
mdmobcmKD2P296GEaNLHJhg.jpg
Cheers!
No Chinese stuff.
Had SanDisk class 10 32gb ultra and a Samsung class 10
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Thursday 16 November 2017 10:19
by heggink
Personally, I would never run any system that I really depend on (NAS, Domoticz) off of an SD card anyway unless I can guarantee that the SD card is not written to an a (semi-)regular basis. SD cards are not meant to run OSes. When you want logging and such, you can run things remote (remote syslog server) but, when things crash, a lot of the buffering is lost (typically the latest info leading up to the issue). I have become so dependent on domoticz that, for me, SD cards are no valid option. SSD probably yes, HDD same thing.
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Thursday 16 November 2017 16:20
by pvm
A nas can support a raid drive configuration. A hard drive crash even doesn't cause an issue in that way
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Thursday 16 November 2017 20:54
by heggink
pvm wrote:A nas can support a raid drive configuration. A hard drive crash even doesn't cause an issue in that way
Depends on the size of the disk, it's URE rate and the type of raid. You wouldn't be the first one to see a disk fail and the resilver stop because of an error on the remaining disks. Disk sizes nowadays exceed URE rates leading to definite disk errors. 10^14 is the standard where 10^15 should be the norm. If Red drives would have that then they would be worth it but they have the same as greens.
Re: PI or NAS
Posted: Thursday 16 November 2017 21:37
by heggink
Maybe but, having gone through a number of failing drives over the years, resilvering beats restore by a large margin. Still, backups are key whether nas or domoticz.